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Post by Deleted on Jun 29, 2016 19:28:25 GMT
A Succubus, the Iconic Essence Thief. Species Name: Essence Thief (Demon sub-class) Starting Planet: Any (except Heaven) Starting Power: 400-800 Appearance: Being a subclass of normal Demons, Essence Thieves are visually similar to them except that they never reach a truly monstrous form; all Essence Thieves are essentially humanoid with some defining characteristics such as fangs, horns, or oddly colored skin/eyes/etc. Many Essence Thieves have a slim and slender build, hinting at their reduced strength but higher speed, and many are beautiful by humanoid standards in order to lower the guard of their victims. Background: Essence Thieves are a subclass of Demons that have the ability to steal the vitality or life-essence of their victims through physical touch. Once thought to have been an artificial creation it is now realized that at birth/formation any demon has the chance to be an Essence Thief, irrevocably changing their destiny. Essence Thieves are considered weaklings amongst their more physically imposing Demonic brethren; facing incessant bullying and sometimes torture at the hands of the stronger demons. This is because Essence Thieves are unable to draw strength from the Makyo Star, and instead have to rely on their Essence Theft ability to gain the same amount of power that flows freely through other Demons at the time of the Makyo Star. Most Essence Thieves never live long enough to reach their potential under the treatment of other Demons, and their beginning weakness often spells their doom. For this reason many Essence Thieves have a rather poor view of other Demons and separate themselves from them whenever possible, instead finding themselves more comfortable amongst the mortal races, from which they can easily find victims to feed upon from. The defining characteristic of Essence Thieves is of course their Essence Theft, this ability allows the user to drain the vitality from a defeated or willing target to supplement their own strength or to heal themselves. The method and manner of this Theft can be different for each Thief, but all require some form of physical contact that must be maintained through the theft and requires at least thirty seconds to perform completely. Examples of Essence Thieves are Vampires, Succubi/Incubi, Yuki-onna, and Shades, but the list is endless. Name Pun Theme: Same as Demons. Unique Characteristics: Essence Theft – The user touches a target and begins stealing their life energy, or essence, from them. Can only be performed in a Saga/DE on a defeated or willing target. The process requires constant contact, and at the end the target dies. The user then gains 10% of the target's Base PL (up to 10,000 PL gained). In addition for every 20% of the user's Base PL the target had (calculated at that moment and round down to whole number) they gain 1 "Count" towards their "Essence Burn" ability below. Essence Burn – Taking their previously stolen essence the Thief can burn it to give themselves a temporary boost of power, adding a bonus to their transformation for the duration of a thread. This bonus is variable and is based on the number of "Counts" they invest. It takes a total of 1 Count to receive a +1x bonus. A total of 3 Counts to receive a +2x bonus. 6 Counts for a +3x bonus, 10 Counts for a +4x bonus, and finally 15 Counts to receive a +5x bonus. Counts used are immediately lost, but an Essence Thief can store as many Counts as they have Technique Slots. Star-Cursed – Despite being Demons, Essence Thieves are rejected by the Makyo Star and cannot gain strength from it and are in fact weakened by it. An Essence Thief under the effects of the Makyo Star cannot use their highest Transformation multiplier, instead using the next highest. Essence Thieves with only Demonic Will cannot use any transformation in this circumstance. Elusive – Due to their weakness in comparison to others Essence Thieves are good at making a quick retreat when they feel their destruction is imminent. During a Saga/DE an Essence Thief gains a +2x bonus to their Defensive power, stackable with their transformations. If and only if used to immediately exit a Saga/DE during the Makyo Star Event, it can ignore the effects of Star Cursed. Hybrids gain Essence Theft (only to gain Counts for Essence Burn), Essence Burn (maximum bonus is reduced to +3x), and Star-Cursed. Transformations:Name | Power Level Multiplier
| Power Level Requirement
| Additional Requirements/Notes
| Demonic Will
| 4x
| 0 | Starting Transformation
| Vitae Sipper
| 8x | 20,000 | Requires Essence Theft/Permanent
| Essence Thief
| 10x | 110,000 | -
| Life Drinker
| 15x | 160,000 | Permanent | Soul Reaper
| 22x | 250,000 | -
| Infernal Rogue
| 45x | 490,000 | Requires Essence Theft/Permanent
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Vi-Poi
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Post by Vi-Poi on Jun 30, 2016 1:41:31 GMT
Hi there! It looks like you've done a lot of work here. Unfortunately, there are some formative issues with the species that will prevent any implementation. First and foremost -- we don't allow any alterations of species, including the creation of 'subclass' or 'subspecies.' Just as you can't make your own version of Saiyans, you can't make your own version of Demons. This is why, a lot of the time, if someone makes something close to one of the canon species we urge them just to roll that instead. So no demon, or demon-like creature. Now, for the transformations (and this is a mistake I see commonly), Custom Species are Aliens, and Aliens can only follow the A, B, or C transformation pathways. I see you've made an Alien B here, but your species can create a semi-permanent multiplier stack that adds to this, and that's not allowed. The highest we've allowed for any Alien species, is a 1-shot, once per thread x2, and something like that would be expected to come with a drawback. Which segues into another issue... The Unique Characteristics are really way too good. Essence Theft, Burn, and Elusive would be tremendous advantages on their own, with nothing else. But all three together would make Essence Thieves extreme. I do have a solution for you though, if you'd still like to play an Essence Thief. Roll a Demon. You can make your x4 attack the 'essence thief/burn' where the stealing of energy and its immediate use is RPed. Or you could use you x4 to make a super defensive move / dodge. Then during the Makyo Star, you could have your character cursed, and RP as blighted by its influence.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 30, 2016 3:01:03 GMT
Hi there! It looks like you've done a lot of work here. Unfortunately, there are some formative issues with the species that will prevent any implementation. First and foremost -- we don't allow any alterations of species, including the creation of 'subclass' or 'subspecies.' Just as you can't make your own version of Saiyans, you can't make your own version of Demons. This is why, a lot of the time, if someone makes something close to one of the canon species we urge them just to roll that instead. So no demon, or demon-like creature. I'll be honest, I wanted to flavor this race as a subclass of Demons in order to give those who wanted to be a mystical demon guy have a race that isn't...and this is my personal opinion... mechanically shit. If there's no way around this, then the idea stops here, but for the sake of defending my logic I'll reply to the rest. Concept taken directly from the Majin, who gain extra multipliers to their transformations based on the number of absorptions they've performed. I assumed since it existed it'd be acceptable. Essence Theft and Essence Burn both together aren't even as strong as a Majin's Absorption ability. The percentage absorbed (10%) was taken directly from the Majin's absorption, and the secondary effect of building up counts was taken ad hoc from a Bio-Android's Bio-metabolize ability. Whereas a Majin gains a PERMANENT boost, the Essence Thief gains only a temporary boost. It takes 3 kills against equal powered people to gain enough Counts to use the 5x option ONCE, whereas a Majin would have gained a permanent +3x to their Def PL and +1x to their Atk PL with the same number of kills. Elusive was supposed to be taken as the inverse of a Heran's Battle Lust ability. Instead of focusing on ATK PL it raised Def PL. The downside was supposed to be Star-Cursed, since 1/4th of the time an Essence Thief was at a serious handicap against an equal PL opponent, especially against other Demons. Again, this was meant to be an option for those who wanted to play a demon without being the worst mechanical race. Their Transformation multipliers are consistently the lowest of all the races, with only their Hakaio being not dead-last. Their Racial abilities are in my opinion also sub-par. 2 total abilities, when most races get 3 minimum, one of which is severely underpowered. A single additional Tech slot, not worth a Racial Ability. The Demon's special ability that adds an extra 4x is useful, but is completely offset again by a Demon's abysmal (hehe a pun) Trans Multiplier throughout their career. Since even with their 4x ability their maximum attack trans multiplier reaches 45x, which many races including Humans, Saiyans, Every Type A and B Custom Species, Arcosians, and Hybrids can meet or beat with their Transformation. Also it's a one use per thread ability, so a Demon is in a poorer situation than this most of the time. So yeah, I've said my piece, if there really is no hope to make a Demon-subclass, there's no point to this race from my PoV, but if someone else wants to form this into a different theme and tweak the Racials then have at it!
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Vi-Poi
Administrator
Premier of Earth
PL: 434,410
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Post by Vi-Poi on Jun 30, 2016 23:30:29 GMT
It sounds like this might be better done in a 'Demon Overhaul Suggestion' thread then. But to counter some of your points -- what people consider competitive depends highly upon where any individual player is in the gamespace, where the highest density of active players are in the gamespace, and where the strongest are in the gamespace. If 0-500,000 PL along an axis represents the gamespace, we can say that the highest density of player PL will tend to move rightward as the game ages. We can also say with confidence that the strongest players will tend to move rightward, but at a slower pace thanks to some intervention. Changing species to be more competitive against the main cluster, or changing species to be more competitive against specific high players, defeats the entire purpose of Species balancing. The species are supposed to experience highs and lows throughout the gamespace. Demons were very good in an early, young Souls. They began with a free x3, had an early and very strong x8. They have access to a x13 30,000 PL before SSJ's x12 at 100,000 PL. They're not the greatest in terms of where the gamespace is now. But they're not at all in a bad spot. A Demon at 240,000 PL can edge out SSJ2 at 250,000 if they play their cards well. And if not, they're still well within 80%. The Demons have another thing going for them besides the x4 (which is one of the best UCs anyone has) --they're the earliest risers. They're the only species to peak below 400,000 PL, and they're consistently faster than any other species for any comparable transformation. So I would disagree with you that they're in a bad spot mechanically. Maybe in the gamespace that you'd like to be competitive in they're not on top, but no species was meant to enjoy an 'always strong' option. The only species that comes close to always being great is Majin due to their stack and their frequent tiering.
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Post by Pieter Wolfbane on Jul 1, 2016 0:26:38 GMT
I've got 2 thoughts that do need expression first, before anything else:
1) Essence Thief and it's triple-sided power, since Essence Burn is a part of Essence Thief, is WAAAAAY too strong. The reason we've restricted Bio-Androids and Majins from having the ability to constantly absorb makes their equity value virtually infinite and explicitly unfair to anyone opposing them, especially with both having the potential to regenerate (since most Bio-Androids are the type to wanna absorb things, except the few like Walker). Not to mention, since everyone likes to talk to each other, there's an occasional matter where we can find relationships OOCLY inflicting the IC set up. This would still be powerful, even if it were set to 1% with, due to the nature of how Essence Thief interacts with Essence Burn.
2) Demons aren't actually underpowered... At all! Believe me, they're not underpowered. I had a whole rant many months back, if you recall, and you can see that in the old discussions area of the suggestion section, or someone buried in the suggestions section. Turns out, the issue was that the wording (unchanged from when I first put in the transformations, after the site voted for the reveal of transformations) was that it only clarified that it did the following Equation, for power output:
(100% current powerx U, where U represents the number of turns taken to charge, up to a maximum of 5)+(base power levelx4)
The equation above is explaining that you charge for 5 rounds at 100% you power, then you add your base x4. Simple, but weak... The actual equation is the following:
(100% current powerx U, where U represents the number of turns taken to charge, up to a maximum of 5)+(100% current power+(base power levelx4)
^That equation is saying, where all OTHER races charge for 5 rounds, Demons 'cheat' the fifth round of charging by instantly adding another 100%+(basex4), so they can even compete with Humans of Legend level or any other race in a massive clash of power!
Now, I wouldn't mind seeing another route or two for Demons to follow (or see 2 'Demons' and 1 'Devil', if we were to split them apart into Subcategories of types). However, it may be better to see just one alternate route the Demons could follow, rather than 2. From there, we'd have to do a bunch of experimentation with the plans and figure out what should work and what wouldn't work, and why.
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