Post by Pieter Wolfbane on Jul 2, 2015 4:57:57 GMT
Hmm... PL modifiers, I feel, should continue to go through, but only for PL related threads. Also, having a 1:2 ratio for Shoki seems like it can get really out of hand, considering people can hoard Shoki up and, when it comes to a certain point, they're gonna have a LOT of PL coming to them if the Shoki's going convert to PL as people revive... I'd go with the 1:1 ratio here (prefer to go lower, but the option's not there. 1(PL):.75(Shoki) would be my highest point).
I think, if you're going for shoki, you shouldn't gain loads of PL on top of it. That's meant to be the point of shoki; its an investment, like PL or zenni. I agree with getting a little bit of PL at the same time, but not... way more, with weight/LMB modifiers, especially with the bonus for focusing solely on PL in the afterlife, in the other Poll.
Post by Pieter Wolfbane on Jul 4, 2015 20:27:40 GMT
Thoughts: You'd have to earn enough Shoki for weights earned in the AL. I feel as though having weights be transferred to the AL would not fine. We'll tell them, "So, Afterlife's going to have some very good benefits for training! However, you have to get your weights once more, if you want them to be considered applicable.
i personally feel that you shouldn't be able to buy any weights for the AL but that's just me.
What would be cool though is if, when you get training from one of the two AL fellas, they just give you weights when you purchase the Gi or something.
And now I'm feeling like I agree with Hyoza. AL seems to be becoming too easy in terms of gains. Maybe I'll swap my vote back to 1:2, as in hindsight it seems a bit more...fair? Maybe fair is the wrong word but I mean you did die so I think gains should be lessened just a teensy bit because you get the added bonus of possibly getting two very strong Specials.
Key word with that is possibly, which is one of the reasons I support the 1:1 with modifiers. Most of the users of AL aren't going to be getting those techniques, and for many of them the Shoki progression is going to be a pure punishment, because it's the only experience you can spend whose purchase can wind up not providing any competitive benefit.
The way I look at it, WC is your raw experience. You flavor your XP as either PL or Zeni. PL is permanent, and never goes down. Zeni is mostly permanent. You either always have it, or it's made useful, it's progression value expressed in an item's price. The non-permanent aspect of Zeni are the expendable items like senzu beans, but even these provide a direct competitive advantage.
Entering AL means you've lost a direct competition against another player. You are then forced to translate a certain amount of your WC -- your XP -- into Shoki to progress back into the normal game -- having a body, a meaningful PL, eventually reconnecting with events and with people. You must spend Shoki for that. The Shoki spent here for the Body and the Ticket doesn't bestow any competitive advantage to the player, it only removes restrictions that were put upon the player during death.
Shoki spent for techniques would bestow a competitive advantage. But the spending of the Shoki here won't be the normal experience. The normal experience will be paying to get through the progression barriers described above.
When I look at the issue from this perspective, I see players being punished for losing in direct competition, forced to expend WC -- their raw experience -- into a black hole before they are allowed to meaningfully compete again. That's why I think there needs to be a 1:1 dual stream, to inject normality into AL.
The 1:1 isn't calling for a PL modifier add-on, or an AL bonus, some kind of perk. All the 1:1 is saying is, the player's game experience continues to be normal.
From a practical RP side of it, I think it makes more sense too. In the case of reduced PL gains for Shoki rewards, we will see someone amassing huge WC to rake in large Shoki to train with a tutor, but not increase much at all in power. Imagine Goku not exploding in power while on King Kai's planet, or not attaining SSJ3 in heaven. It doesn't make much canonical sense to me.
I think a lot of our issue here comes with Shoki itself. Shoki was a currency hoisted up to resolve the main issue of AL, revivals. It might have been a more elegant solution to have PL gains translate to certain milestones, because it would reward the player for their hard work and progress the situation. Plus, Shoki is one of the components of ki.
but this has just doubled afterlife gains in one fell swoop, since shoki converts directly into pl already... (also, it's kinda thrown out the shoki costing matrix since the afterlife items weren't balanced with this in mind).
We'll have to see how this goes and hope it doesn't snowball.
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