Pipa
Archived
PL: 19,119; Great Namek(Demonic Will) (x3); Makyo Star(x8); Items: One-Use Space Pod, Onyx Scimitar, 1 5,000PL Guard, Upgraded Ship (6 occupant ship), x80 Gravity Chamber, Heavy Weights; Zeni: 0
|
Post by Pipa on Jan 18, 2015 6:19:01 GMT
Attention citizens of WOD, this is an important topic handling the rulings on character to character transfers. Please think carefully about this stuff and give us some feedback. Currently, you may transfer up to 20,000 pl from one character to a completely new one, provided that the first character is erased from existence altogether. In this I will present several cases to help drive the discussion forward. The case of Orion's death. Orion died fighting Koramund, who absorbed his remains. The transfer request to a new character, Ora, was denied on the grounds that he had died. The rule in question- Dead characters can not be transferred for PL. My personal opinion is that the transfer should have been allowed to take place. Presumably, Orion should still be playable in HFIL right now, so he is still a character. Therefor I believe that the transaction should be allowed. If this is not allowed it also makes my plans for using Pokopen at death with Pipa to create Pipa jr. impossible, so I do have a little bias. The case of VrykaWyntre Cold posted a solo thread implying Vryka's death and wants to transfer both power level and zeni over to Wyntre. The rule in question- (Same as above with dead characters.) Zeni is not mentioned as transferable. The other rule in question- Characters already in play aren't mentioned for receiving a transfer. My personal opinion is that busting your old character open like a piggy bank is unreasonable. As for to living characters, I don't see a problem with it. I would want it stipulated that a single character can only get such a transfer once. The case of Emer, Oni, and MilacAll three of us have deleted our accounts in the past, but have returned requesting PL transfers. The accounts that had the PLs no longer exist. The rule in question- Transferring accounts I would say no. Transfers should be for those who are either active or who left on at least neutral terms. I was super pissed off at not getting any feedback when I posted up Kami stuff, but there would have been constructive ways to get things done rather than delete my account out of spite. For the mods who deleted, a more reasonable action would have been to retire from modhood and maybe even help train your replacements. President Bao wants this behavior to stop. However I do believe we shouldn't be punished. If Oni wants to bring back his character or I want to bring back Milac we should have the rights to do so, even if a little retconning is necessary. Loss of power can be easily explained in most cases.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 18, 2015 8:37:20 GMT
I would personally say to not allow ANY transfers at all. Power Level or Zeni at all. I mean that it will make people not train up their characters. It is not fair to new players to have someone just kill characters willy nilly and transfer their powers to a new character. It will bring in super powered characters at next to no time invested on them.
|
|
Koramund
Archived
PL: 121,168
Bio Metabolize(x3)
Zeni: 2,003
Shoki: 7,708
Tag: @koramund
OOC Name: Saiyan, Namekian, Human
Posts: 694
|
Post by Koramund on Jan 18, 2015 13:40:24 GMT
However Ninjin, "It will make people not train up their characters." is false. If you can train up to 20K, that is still about a 6th of what it takes to get to Tier 2 transformations. They are weak. If I murdered Athren and he put all his PL into a new character, he would be losing over 75K PL! 20K is first earned, and then sharable through the user, kinda like a small life line. You don't restart completely, but you do restart a big distance.
However, I feel the number should be increased to 25% of the person's PL when they died base, which is a highly inefficient 1-4. For example, lets say I died right now. 34,551 PL, I would only have 8638 PL. My belief is that 20K is the base, and from above 80K you should be able to keep a bigger chunk for your dedication to working. Plus, as soon as Other World is involved and Instant-transmission (Which I am making a form of...) we can go to Earth and the Cosmos/Spirit realm constantly without losing PL.
|
|
Kadbra
Rising Soul
PL: 23,827; Demonic Will (x3): 71,481 Makyo (x8) 190,616; Items: Heavy Weights (3,144.5 | 9,433.5 | 25,156); One-Use Space Pod; Black Great Sword; Senzu Bean 1; Zeni: 404
Tag: @kadbra
Posts: 106
|
Post by Kadbra on Jan 18, 2015 15:45:27 GMT
I agree with Ninjin, PL transfer should not be allowed, for a simple reason. Dying does not mean you no longer get to play a character. The Next World is well established in canon, and consists out of way more than just Heaven and Hell (we never actually get to see Heaven, only the realm of the Kais and Kaioshins). You can train there, interact with other dead characters and NPCs, and hell, strong enough people can be sent back to Earth for short periods of time MULTIPLE TIMES, just not in quick succession. Not to mention that you can be brought back to life eventually, or even just get so powerful that you can literally rip through the dimensions and just leave (though that requires power of mastered SSJ3 levels)
|
|
Pipa
Archived
PL: 19,119; Great Namek(Demonic Will) (x3); Makyo Star(x8); Items: One-Use Space Pod, Onyx Scimitar, 1 5,000PL Guard, Upgraded Ship (6 occupant ship), x80 Gravity Chamber, Heavy Weights; Zeni: 0
|
Post by Pipa on Jan 18, 2015 16:06:07 GMT
It is 20k guys. ><
But in all seriousness I can agree to the no transfers. In the short time I have removed my transfer bonus I have been able to connect with other players a lot faster, instead of being stuck in a very weird position where most of the people of my pl tier had already sort of cliqued out. Then again with heavy weights it will take very little time to get back up there.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 18, 2015 19:45:06 GMT
Kora the reason as to why I say that there should be no transfers at all is this. How long did it take you to get to 20k? A good while. So would you want someone who kills off a character and creates a new one not have to do that? The initial climb is part of what establishes a character. And as Pipa said with the system of Heavy Weights and the Gravity Chambers you can literally just grind the power back rather quick.
|
|
|
Post by Pieter Wolfbane on Jan 19, 2015 3:51:38 GMT
You're also forgetting the case with Tsumuri Takeda. Tsumuri had another character that had nothing being done, and thus, it was determined that the character was at the tournament grounds and among those slain by Tsumuri and, in the process, their essence being devoured to strengthen the character. This was an approved case because it had made sense (we had 20+ characters hopping in there out of the blue, only having about half roughly in there rping actively...) that the hybrid's demonic traits were billowing up to the surface and were becoming hungry for souls and power.
I will tell you the cases I agree and disagree with here that you mentioned that qualify for power level transfers. First off, I do agree that it's appropriate for power level services.
Orion's Case: I agree with the ruling here. Koramund had made a clean kill, even if Orion had killed himself, and sucked up his body. I don't see it as appropriate that, in all honesty and no offense meant, that the character was practically retconned back to life in a different saiyan, Orache. Also, as you said, the character's in HFIL... His power would be transferred over there with his soul.
Vryka's Case: I actually don't know how the story went here to qualify the character getting the power level transfer. In all honesty, I don't even remember it actually happening. Someone fetch a link to this discussion and it's poll for me and anyone else that's lacking knowledge of the matter!
Oni, Emer, and Milac: It was believed, on my part, that you guys had over-reacted to situations by deleting your accounts. Having talked to you and Emer about it, they had been OOC reasons that had gotten out of hand. I'm a guy for 2nd chances. If they're squandered, so be it. However, I feel there should be a 2nd chance for such instances... This is not meant to incite frustration, it's just my mentality on the matter.
The transfer, I feel, needs to be a situation where the player should be given the option to transfer strength, should they match the criteria... HOWEVER, at the same time, as it was put, the instance is strenuous and it's shown better results, from what Pipa observed, with the player-base on here. The transfer, if you all are still looking at it, should have the following ruling:
"Should you ask for a transfer of up to 20k power level, you sacrifice the option of doing a Presentation for your character. The transfer must require a character have been retired to be sacrifice all or part of their power. Should the character lose the entirety of its power level in this transfer, its life is then ceased and sent to Other World to join the Souls of the Dead."
Of course, this would bring out the following thought:
"Should you retire the character, and not kill it off in a blaze of glory or some obscene manner, you have the option to return it from retirement. Retirement does not mean death! It means that this character is still around to be rp'd with, if someone requests it of you and you are up for it!"
That's a subject on its own, though...
|
|
|
Post by Wyntre Cold on Jan 19, 2015 5:01:33 GMT
Vryka's Case: I actually don't know how the story went here to qualify the character getting the power level transfer. In all honesty, I don't even remember it actually happening. Someone fetch a link to this discussion and it's poll for me and anyone else that's lacking knowledge of the matter! There wasn't actually any discussion or poll, this had already been discussed earlier for some earlier cases and I only went along with that. Death Thread= wodsouls.freeforums.net/thread/1553/last-laughProfile= wodsouls.freeforums.net/thread/1013/vrykaI had asked quite a few times and it had been smiled upon, then I asked Bao to grade in in PM and he said he'd do it when he's not busy, which I'm fine with. I'd like to also say that I think transfers should be allowed IF they where not killed by another player. My reason being is that they may fall out of activity and without a transfer, we're wasting PL and Zeni. We don't want to waste, because waste is inefficient and inefficiency leads to a lacking site.
|
|
|
Post by President Bao on Jan 24, 2015 7:13:26 GMT
To clarify the official intent of the transfer ruling: The idea was that graded gains are transferable(free gains however are not, such as the free pl added due to your race, free zeni for being a new char, pl unlocks from the corresponding figures, etc.). In practice this has meant pl, going strictly by the letter of the law it could mean pl and zeni. One could argue that zeni shouldn't be transferred, as your pl gains are likely to have been influenced by the items you bought meaning your new character has already been given a decent compensation. Equally, one could argue that maybe items shouldn't but zeni itself should. Really, it all comes down to community preference I guess. ---- A concern with Orion's situation is that it's a possible exploit. Make character, offer it up for absorption when you're ready to transfer, absorber gets the bonus and you tag out to your new character scot free. I must admit I kinda just let that one do it's own thing, I don't recall giving a verdict on that myself. As for merged gains into an existing character, there is still somewhat of a question over it, so the current process is to do it on a case by case basis which the person applies for. Finally in terms of deleted account the logic there is: - The account no longer exists, the character is gone permanently through it's own creators choice. No character to transfer from means both transferring and restoring characters really shouldn't be a thing if you specifically chose to delete. - Using what someone 'remembers' someone else's pl to roughly be is a can of worms I'd rather avoid, could be biased, exploited or inaccurate. - and the last that I brought up was that I don't want to encourage this behaviour. One of the reasons we don't delete accounts(they are added to an archive instead for those that don't know) is to preserve their data and allow the person to come back if they so choose. If you decide to burn that bridge on your way out I can't stop you, but if you do then the damage to our records is done and cannot be undone, and I'd prefer to disincentivise such damage. ---- In terms of denying people beginners posts for reincarnated characters, beginners presentations are important for establishing a character and proving they are what you really want to RP, so I kinda think a blanket rule of always requiring one is a good thing to keep in place. Not being 'allowed' to do one isn't really a punishment except in the meta sense of possibly baiting them into a character they don't have the drive for. --- (2)
|
|
Ora
Archived
PL: 75,332; Oozaru(x10): 753,320; Items: One Use Space Pod, Heavy Weights (4th of PL), 2 Senzu Beans; Scouter; Zeni: 849
Tag: @nitroji
Posts: 197
|
Post by Ora on Jan 24, 2015 15:44:01 GMT
---- A concern with Orion's situation is that it's a possible exploit. Make character, offer it up for absorption when you're ready to transfer, absorber gets the bonus and you tag out to your new character scot free. I must admit I kinda just let that one do it's own thing, I don't recall giving a verdict on that myself. For the record, I didn't "offer". I simply wanted to kill him off.
|
|
Pipa
Archived
PL: 19,119; Great Namek(Demonic Will) (x3); Makyo Star(x8); Items: One-Use Space Pod, Onyx Scimitar, 1 5,000PL Guard, Upgraded Ship (6 occupant ship), x80 Gravity Chamber, Heavy Weights; Zeni: 0
|
Post by Pipa on Jan 26, 2015 22:37:49 GMT
Turnover Summary (for whoever wants to finish this stuff up) Currently, we have the following doctrine developed for the sites transfer policy. 1. Transfers are a thing.2. Limited to one time + character deaths in DE threads. More polling is required as more ideas have been presented. 3. Zeni transfers are prohibbited4. Deleted accounts (Currently Pending- if a majority of the sits active population doesn't vote on it I would recommend a revote and further discussion.)
Things that still need discussed. 5. Orion's PL. Does he lose out because it could potentially be an exploit? 6. Can you transfer onto an existing account 7. Should all those before the finalization of these rulings receive an amnesty transfer, being as the rules were not made clear?
|
|