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Post by lee41 on Jul 14, 2014 10:41:59 GMT
Heeeeeeyyy, guuuyyyysss!!!!! You know who I am already, so let us get started. Now, most races has 1 or 2 transformations, but what we was looking at is more transformations. ^^ Here is the followings for humans. Hidden Power (x6): This is a very powerful transformation that humans has. The user taps into their hidden strength and gain an huge x6 boost in power, releasing the restraints within. Their skin was turning into a shade of red due to increased blood flow, their hair stood on end, their eyes turn completely white and veins will bulged around their temples and body, muscle mass will increased slightly. Ki output will be increased tremendously, the energy they was giving off is now green as the aura became slightly wild and flame-like. But this form put a strain on the body and draining the body's resources slowly. If used for too long, it will exhausted the user. Hidden Power 2 (x9): Another powerful transformation that surpassed Hidden Power. The user released more restraints within the body, gaining an tremendous x9 increase in power. Their skin turning a darker shade of red while more veins bulged around their temples and body, muscle mass will increased slightly even more and the muscle tone became more defined than normal. Their hair stood up more and became a bit rigid while their ki output increased drastically. Their voice also became deeper in this form. Due to increased energy radiation, the aura became more flame-like and wild accompanied by blue static electrical currents surrounded them. This form put a greater strain on the body and drained the body's resources fast, leaving the user very exhausted if used for long periods of time. Hidden Power 3 (x12): Another powerful transformation that surpassed the first 2 Hidden Power forms in power. The user released more restraints within the body, pushing themselves to the limit in the process, gaining a enormous x12 increase. Their skin was turning a bit darker shade of red while more veins bulged around their temples, forehead, and body as the aura around them became a dark green, the electrical currents was turning a darker blue. Ki output is increased tremendously, the energy they give off was now wild. Their voice became a bit deeper. But it put a greater strain on the body and drained the body's resources quickly, leaving the user extremely exhausted afterwards. Hidden Power 4 (x15): A very strong transformation that surpassed the previous Hidden Power forms. The user taps into their inner strength even further, released more restraints, gaining a massive x15 increase. Their eyes was glowing white as the aura around them is now blue, the electrical currents was white now as they retains their Hidden Power 3 appearance. But it increased the strain put on the body further and drained the body's resources rapidly, leaving them extremely exhausted if used for long periods of time. Thoughts? What did you guys think?
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Post by Pieter Wolfbane on Jul 15, 2014 1:37:24 GMT
They don't look bad, but at the moment, we're trying not to take a look at Tier 2 or higher transformations. I will make a rebuttal to the first form, though. That time IS approaching, but I don't feel it is necessary to look at them as of yet.
(As a place holder for the transformation details currently.)
Intense Struggle (x4) - Tapping into a latent reserve of energy reserved for only the closest encounters, humans can undergo a 4x increase of power. This can cause immense physical change to muscle size, or none at all. After the battle has finished, and assuming the human has survived, they will probably be on their way to the hospital. Once they reach 20,000 PL this can be activated at will.
Everything, first off, has Hidden Power in the first place. Humans, though, are very emotional beings that go really primal deep down. Certain factors need to be met in order to at least transform into this. in which case, the normal incentive to undergo Intense Struggle is that they are put into a setting where their more primitive instincts are unlocked temporarily. Humans are meant to be more like the under dogs of Dragon Ball: The ones you don't expect to kick ass.
Take Krillin vs. Cell. He would've lost hid life had he not been using this instinct to dodge for the life of himself! He managed to hold his ground long enough against it until the others arrived to his aid. Now, Krillin's a very experienced fighter and is very much capable of tapping into this power at will. In the past, Krillin had to be put near death, much like in all his fights before this surge of power could happen. This is a controlled/master'd instance of Intense Struggle.
When he was nearly killed by Frieza's 2nd form, he couldn't tap into this power at will and had to be put into a desperate situation. The sheer will to not want to die allowed him to hold out until he was rescued by Dende, after being stabbed, was when this intense struggle happened.
Thus, with these reasons, I believe we needn't worry about the first tier. If you want me to talk about the 2nd tier, I will oblige, but I feel 1st tier should be the current focus.
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Post by President Bao on Jul 15, 2014 3:22:10 GMT
'trying not to look' = 'no one has done that yet' Truth is, Akio was the one who defined the current transformations, and for the beginning of the site, future transformations were indeed not such a priority as it takes a long time for people to reach the 'next level'. What I see there isn't too bad Though they'd need to also have the requirements listed before we could do a real comparison, since different forms have different pl requirements before they can be unlocked. Also glad to see someone interested and getting involved in content development for the site, this is the sort of stuff I've been expecting more of! While I'm not to familiar with Naruto, I get the feeling that the turning red and having those mutiple levels thing is based on rock lee's release chakra gate thing. ((So incase you didn't know, when it comes to your character you can 'flavor' your RP any way you like, meaning 'story-wise' your transformations and stuff can be/work however you want, so long as 'game-wise' they don't change the rules/give you an unfair advantage. Meaning instead of 'intense struggle', your x3 human starter trans could be called 'ki gate release' and you get red skin and white eyes and a green aura when it's active; perfectly acceptable as long as people don't go too whacky )) In the specific case of possible human transformations, I too have acctually been thinking over transformations due to the fast approaching 'site patch' , not just humans, but all races. Here is what I had come up with for them, based in part upon Rensou's work; Humans:
| | Multi
| | pl req
| | start pl 400-800
| |> Human Traits:
|
| Intense Struggle
| | 3* | 0
| req. desperation
| | Faster Techniques | (every 4000 instead of 6000) | Mastered Focus | | 3 | 20,000 |
| | Currency Savvy
| 500 extra starting zeni | Ro'shi
| | 6
| 70,000
| req. ki suppression
| |
| gain zeni at increased rate (+0.1) | Spiritual Enlightenment
| | 16
| 140,000
| perm
| | |
| Spiritual Ascension
| | 23
| 250,000
|
| | |
| Legend
| | 50
| 500,000
| perm
| | |
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After everyone discusses this topic a little more, we can potentially put out a vote, and see which (if either) people would like to have implemented ((and to clarify in case there's any confusion, I'm not posting the above part up 'as an admin', I'm posting this up as a fellow member like Lee. All of you should feel free and welcome to be doing the same when it comes to anything about the site ))
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Post by Pieter Wolfbane on Jul 15, 2014 5:24:59 GMT
I'm still in the midst of getting used the much more democratic system. What I said is my opinion. I feel like the current guidelines for Humans Akio set, at least for the first transformation, are much more satisfactory. After all, we have x10 transformations and demons with easy to use forms already.
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Zucceta
Administrator
PL: 379,083
Oozaru(x10) MSSj(x15) S.Ooz(x22) SSj2(25x)
Zeni: 2290
Tag: @admin
OOC Name: therevolution
Posts: 2,309
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Post by Zucceta on Jul 21, 2014 17:21:22 GMT
(Tiny input)
The later transformations were initially by my 'head design' going to be dictated (excuse the word) by the amount of people per race, and current average PL per person per race. That said, it's now totally up to the current player and staff base, but that was just my old idea back when the power leaning was more 'governed'.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 21, 2014 20:22:41 GMT
Humans get six transformations? What? That kind of doesn't feel fair if that were to work out considering what you listed allows them to get X 50 power when we don't know about what other races might be getting fully. First stage forms should be the focus first here I feel. But that hidden Zeni bonus thing you spoke of Bao just now seems like something that's new and entirely different here. If that's being applied I guess it's all right... Since they also get need lesser power for techniques, but now seeing that makes me wonder about other races. I mean, I'm a demon and I'm not sure what benefits demons get. So if that's what's planned for humans so far I don't know.
I agree that humans should look and act how they want to when they transform though and if you look at Krillen vs. Yamcha or Tien they are completely different people. That's all I have to say.
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Post by Relis on Aug 6, 2014 18:17:25 GMT
I got an idea for a second tier human transformation
Super full power
If you've watched dragonball you know that roshi was capable of accessing a state where he grew into a huge muscle bound behemoth and a less full throttle version of that Mayne the multiplier would be say x 6 multiplier and that could be a great way to level humans with saiyans demons androids name is and all the other races who have easy to get ultra powered transformations. Like overdrive for demons and possibly super saiyan for saiyans as well as a the giant enamel transform all of the arcosians compared to other races we humans get trampled t the start and the only up side is we are ingenious with techniques we need to level the playing.field like seriously
On a side. Note how come no one ever uses roshis transformation , I mean if krillin pulled that one say nappa and vegeta yamcha May have remained with his girlfriend and if tien had pulled that against majin buu, well it would have made absolutely no difference but krillin probably would look awsome like that all super jacked and stuff
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Post by Pieter Wolfbane on Aug 7, 2014 4:13:31 GMT
Actually, I won't lie: That is an old system from a different site. If anything, considering that the final form is a permanent transformation (if we agree to let that remain there), then we should lower the multiplier, as well as the PL amount to make it easier to reach, but more balanced out with the others in the end.
In my opinion, we need to rethink how to work the transformations after human form are. At first, I was thinking that the legend form could be formed as a temporary Avatar state of x48 base with a requirement of 480,000 power level. I still think that's the best idea, honestly. However, after I looked at Ascension and Enlightenment, I thought that it needs removing. Now, my current thought is that, since the two forms are pretty much the same, just reworded, I think ascension should be removed, with Avatar having a x42 base with a 420,000 requirement (Avatar replacing Legend and becoming a temporary form). A mastered Avatar form user, much like a mastered Super Saiyan 3, could have an easier time controlling the state, in addition to having a higher multiplier, up to x46.
Anyway, that's my thought on that portion. On to Uub's point, the Roshi form we see here is actually in a perfect spot. The key element here is that master Roshi had to learn to keep this suppressed, as do other human characters. The form is bulky and slow, very much like the way Vegeta and Trunks fought Cell, and is only necessary in small bursts.
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Post by Relis on Aug 7, 2014 14:20:22 GMT
Hmm perhaps it could be a sort of kaioken technique for humans tier two perhaps because the first transformation hurts the user , perhaps the full power one is a sort of advancement with a need for about 30,000pl to activate it or if your turtle sensei it becomes a technique you already know but with slightly less power
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Post by President Bao on Aug 8, 2014 3:40:22 GMT
Actually, I won't lie: That is an old system from a different site. If anything, considering that the final form is a permanent transformation (if we agree to let that remain there), then we should lower the multiplier, as well as the PL amount to make it easier to reach, but more balanced out with the others in the end. In my opinion, we need to rethink how to work the transformations after human form are. At first, I was thinking that the legend form could be formed as a temporary Avatar state of x48 base with a requirement of 480,000 power level. I still think that's the best idea, honestly. However, after I looked at Ascension and Enlightenment, I thought that it needs removing. Now, my current thought is that, since the two forms are pretty much the same, just reworded, I think ascension should be removed, with Avatar having a x42 base with a 420,000 requirement (Avatar replacing Legend and becoming a temporary form). A mastered Avatar form user, much like a mastered Super Saiyan 3, could have an easier time controlling the state, in addition to having a higher multiplier, up to x46. Anyway, that's my thought on that portion. On to Uub's point, the Roshi form we see here is actually in a perfect spot. The key element here is that master Roshi had to learn to keep this suppressed, as do other human characters. The form is bulky and slow, very much like the way Vegeta and Trunks fought Cell, and is only necessary in small bursts. Based mostly on the old system* It has a number of tweeks here and there from what WoD:Res used. (which itself was heavily modified towards the end by Rensou when he did the full rebalance). Avatar State probably belongs on an Avatar RP rather than a Dragonball one For reference, The design intent behind the proposed ones above was that Humans are the ultimate late-game race. At perm x50 they are the highest mutiplier anyone can achieve, and this is on purpose, to compensate for that fact that humans are outmatched for the whole rest of their run. (kinda the opposite of arcosians, who have the most powerful early-game, but cap out early). Also, don't get distracted by the names I whacked down, the two spiritual forms are not the same(though were meant to be linked). Enlightenment was based on Tien, how he was said to have the third eye due to attaining spiritual enlightenment, it is a permanent transformation. Ascension is a temporary form where the human taps into a higher level of power, part of the 'legend' power if you like. (kinda a 'super saiyan for humans' though no gold hair or anything) Legend was a vague tongue-in-cheek reference to earth's hero and living legend, Mr Satan As for the Roshi comment, technically our current human trans lists bulking of muscles as a possible characteristic if people chose to do so. Though the idea of roshi being that and therefore the mastered focus being like his '50%' bulked state, the one he used against Tien, is also cool. Also I've been planning to bring up the fact that 'Power Weighting'(bulking muscles but sacrificing speed) is a technique people can probably learn. Cell, Roshi and Frieza all proved that bulking up was not an inherent part of ('ultra') super saiyan, but rather a separate technique.
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Post by Hyoza on Aug 8, 2014 16:39:17 GMT
Does every race have to have copious transformations? Can't we just increase the progression speed for races with fewer PL multipliers to keep them competitive with characters who have access to more powerful transformations?
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Post by Relis on Aug 8, 2014 16:45:57 GMT
I just want a second tier for every race to sway it out a bit
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Post by lee41 on Aug 12, 2014 17:23:32 GMT
Ki Gate Release?? Man, Bao is a genius!!! I like that, bro. Hehehe, I guess it could be a human starter transformation for me, lol. Anyways, I has to agreed with him. Different transformations has different pl requirements, like Intense Struggle for example. I think that the first Hidden Power form need a pl requirement to activate it willingly. How about 23,000 pl and if you think it was not enough, you can raise it to higher amounts. Also, I was thinking about adding pl requirements to higher tier transformations, such as 30,000 or 40,000 or more so they can activate it willingly if they are experienced and strong enough. Hard work will pay off in the end, heh. ^_^ The question is how can I activate Ki Gate Release? Do I has to get into the horse stance, crossed my arms into an X, and concentrated? Hahaha. xD Then I shout or think the name of the transformation, and says "Open"?? I am not so sure..lol.
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Tao Lung
Rising Soul
PL: 1,671; Intense Struggle (x3): 5,013; Items: 1 use space pod, Heavy Weights (2521.5| 7564.5); Zeni: 2797
Tag: @sacidepatinete
Posts: 172
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Post by Tao Lung on Aug 17, 2014 3:45:10 GMT
In my honest opinion, I think transformations as a concept should be canon. I mean, there aren't many characters in dragonball that can actually transform. Basically, only Frieza's race and the saiyans are shown to have the concept of transformations for at least more than one of their members. Zarbon and Bojack can also be mentioned, but they are the only representants of their race seen transforming, so it's not clear if it's a personal ability or a racial trait. These are temporary power ups. Then, there's demons such as Janemba and Hildegarn who after getting enough butt kicking, go through a metamorphose that completely changes them, what seems to be like a permanent power up.
I once made use of these concepts... For demons, I gave them a transformation that would occur only once in their life , if they ever took a supposedly fatal ammount of damage, where they would change form, heal damage and get a permanent boost to pl, much like happened to Hildegarn and Janemba in the movies. Perhaps something like that could be done? Say a x1.5-x2 pl increase?
For other races whose power ups consists mainly of a wider aura/general bulking up, an universal special technique could be allowed for everyone to learn, despite of race... Unlock Potential was the name of the general power up in Tenkaichi Budokai games I think (just a reference, name doesn't really matter)... The technique wouldn't require a free slot, and perhaps, could be upgraded like usual techniques (maybe adding +1 to the multiplier for each improvement, for example). An association could even be made with the Guru's ability to raise permanently one's power level as you have here in the site. Like, if someone had their hidden potential unlocked by the Guru, the transformation could get another boost to the multiplier, for example. However, it would obviously need to be weaker than racial transformations and it wouldn't be able to stack with another (i.e: Oozaru + Unlocked Potential wouldn't fly... only the highest boost counts).
That way, there's a bit more balance between the races and even gives the saiyans something to rely on, since their transformation although powerful, is very conditional (whole full moon reuierement). And that doesn't necessarily put all races as equals, since you adopted the idea of different starting power levels based off chosen races.
I also find Hyoza's idea very interesting... considering different growth rates for different races. That way, the powerful races could grow slightly faster than the weaker races and we humans could still stick with being the universe's underdogs, having the slowest growing rate XD I mean, in a scenario where "transforming" is a universal technique, aside from racial transformations.
That also gives life to the idea that though some grow in the ranks with little effort, if one train hard enough, even a human can rival an arcosian in power.
That's just my two cents. Sorry if I'm being intrusive.
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Post by Relis on Aug 17, 2014 3:56:53 GMT
Your not this system is entirely democratic so no one can be obtrusove unless a mod has closed the discussion down to a certain group
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